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[GreenYes] Re: Plasma in Panama... sounds like a bad movie

The trouble in Latin America and the Caribbean (including some of the places
I have heard plasma tech pitched), as in much of the developing countries,
there are no tipping fees. In fact, there usually are no landfills, just
dumps, usually open-air, with little to no management. So we?d be talking
government subsidies, usually from governments that can ill afford to
subsidize basic health care, let alone waste management.

Furthermore, unless someone is pre-sorting (who? And who pays them to? How
paid? Under what conditions?), then the wastes going from one of these
dumps (say, for the sake of argument, Duquesa in Santo Domingo, one of the
places this idea was pitched for), WILL have metal (unlike glass, not
heavily recycled in the DR), old automobile batteries, car hulks,
end-of-life electronics, spent portable batteries, infectious medical wastes
(even limbs), pesticides, you name it, it?s all thrown in the dump (if not
in the river).

What made me suspicious about these pitches is that they supposedly solved
all problems, at no cost to government or the general public, and no close
environmental supervision necessary. In my experience, nothing is free and
even cheap wonder techs have their trade-offs. It?s just a question of
discussing the trade-offs fully and openly and weighing the balance of costs
and benefits and deciding priorities. But so far the proponents of this
tech I have heard speak and questioned never seem to remember a trade-off to
speak of. Makes one stroke his/her chin in thought and go ?hmmmm??

As I said, it may be all it?s purported to be. But I still must wonder why,
if it is so beneficial and so cheap, are most of the full-scale projects
(beyond pilot and test phases) announced in China and developing countries
like Panama? Why not California? Massachusetts? New York? Michigan?
Germany? The UK? The Netherlands? Japan? What?s wrong with this picture?
What else are we not being told?


Sr. Keith Edward Ripley

Temas Actuales LLC

telefono: 703-731-7108

e-mail: keith.ripley@no.address


<> El Equipo Verde

Autor del libro "Solid Wastes and Recycling Policy in Latin America & the


Noticias ambientales de América Latina y el Caribe:

Las leyes/los reglamentos ambientales de todo America Latina y el Caribe:

Perspectivas sobre la evolucion de politica sobre el medio ambiente, salud
publica y defensa del consumidor en America Latina y el Caribe:

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From: GreenYes@no.address [mailto:GreenYes@no.address] On Behalf
Of LWheeler45@no.address
Sent: Thursday, September 21, 2006 2:47 PM
To: vze3gxms@no.address; eric@no.address; GreenYes@no.address
Subject: [GreenYes] Re: Plasma in Panama... sounds like a bad movie

Your observations are fairly correct for traditional high power plasma. The
money comes from tipping charges or government subsidy.

Plasma 4th state of matter is a really interesting thing. Using available
technology since 1950's such as Westinghouse Plasma the working area of a
torch is about 16 inches MAX . You need lots of torches and lots of power to
break down waste to gas and elements this way. About 1/2 of the Syn gas
produced is consumed to power up the system. No electical power no plasma no

I compare it to Edision the light bulb and DC power. Works not well on the
large scale.

Using low volatge with a heatsink as on electrical contact totally different
outcome. Heat of the heatsink sustains the decomposition. Each heatsink
adds working area of 16 in approx 8 heatsinks x 16" all in a box 5' 6' 3'
approx. Really efficient and clean!

Anyone who puts any metal in a plasma field for recycle is at minimum an
idiot you get nothing out for the trouble. You put recycles with H and C
compositions such as garbage, manure, ag waste, plastics, auto fluff, old
carpets, paper, cardboard and the like and you get process heat, gasses rich
in C and H and a mini RE refinery. No process I have heard about comes even
close in energy effciency or minimizes greenhouse gases and water use. And
it is really cheap too.

David has the details he can share with you

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