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Re: [GreenYes] Re: The need for respectful diagreement / attitudes toward capitalistic economies
While I praise the leaders of commerce who have prevailed in the present
atmosphere of lunacy and outright lies by the Bush administration, it must
be noted that Interface, Inc is but one example of the wonderful world of
capitalism turned away from the dark side. Such examples are few and far
between. Paul Hawken's "Natural Capitalism" contains others. Still, there is
something lacking in that book; the concept of toxins and what they do in
contact with living things. (i.e.: composite plastics, etc.) The basic
concept of running a more efficient planet is admirable, but it also needs
to be a complete model.

What remains after the right, left and in between issues have been debated,
is that Interface, Inc. is merely reusing a toxic soup called plastic. And
just so I don't get dumped on here... of course the stuff must be reused,
but it would be far better not to make it in the first place. If all
environmental and economic variables are included in a life cycle analysis
of its forms that have been produced, are being produced, or that have been
proposed, plastic is not a sustainable product. Prevention works far better
and is infinitely less expensive than "The Cure."

So, if plants are produced by the typical farming methods of today's
agribusiness (GMOs, synthetic chemical inputs, monocultures), and
manufactured by the same processes as plastics of today (fields of toxic
waste such as in Cancer Alley, LA), plastic made from plant material is
still plastic. As a concept, it is imperative that this list not write off
this view as unprofessional, or radical. Quite the contrary, condoning the
production of plastic is the radical view.

By the same token, it would be a mistake to assume that we cannot change as
a country because we have always done it this way. It may be true that other
economic models have either not worked or are failing, but one must examine
the reasons. Many times it is because financial interests in this country
have scuttled it via the overt and/or covert actions of the US government. H
istory is full of examples.

The present WTO/IMF/NAFTA/GATT... model of globalization is a prime example.
The only way it can function is in secretive meetings protected by a
cavalcade of heavily armed thugs that spray, bomb, and rub hazardous
chemicals into the eyes of those who stand up for their rights. Refusing to
recognize the rights of indigenous peoples to grow crops they have had for
millennia, it patents them and then charges the people to grow them. By this
model, the financial interests of corporations override the rights of people
to a clean and healthy environment. (i.e.: MTBE)

At an auto show in Los Angeles a couple days ago, an AP article quoted David
Ransom, Cadillac manager of professional vehicles as saying, "If you are
going to go global you need to address armoring." I must ask, if capitalism
is so wonderful, then why do these leaders of industry need to armor their
ostentatious and inefficient Cadillacs"?

In conclusion, this group must have some standards to uphold, but
considering what capitalism has spawned, the use of derogatory or diminutive
terms to describe the corporate leaders is quite understandable, perhaps not
completely acceptable, but truly understandable.

Paul Goettlich

From: "Jay Donnaway" <>
To: "'Roger Guttentag'" <>; "GreenYes Listserve
(E-mail)" <>
Sent: Wednesday, January 16, 2002 8:21 AM
Subject: RE: [GreenYes] Re: The need for respectful diagreement / attitudes
toward capitalistic economies

> Bravo Roger,
> If this list moves toward a more professional exchange of practical ideas,
> will happily support it.  Otherwise, I will simply write it off as another
> den of extremists who enjoy compaining more than making any substantive
> contributions toward a sustainable future.
> -Not to in any way demean GRRN's recent coup with the BEAR report- very
> impressive.
> Jay Donnaway

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