GreenYes Digest V98 #54

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Fri, 22 Jan 1999 17:33:03 -0500

GreenYes Digest Mon, 2 Mar 98 Volume 98 : Issue 54

Today's Topics:
glass crushers
My response to Mr. Zadorsky answer.
The right of answer of Mr. Zadorsky

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Problems you can't solve otherwise to

Loop-Detect: GreenYes:98/54

Date: Sun, 1 Mar 1998 17:29:50 -0600 From: (Inga VanNynatten) Subject: glass crushers


Try JD Porter with the Andela Glass Pulverizer. 512-708-9875.


Inga VanNynatten Master's Student Community and Regional Planning Program Uunviersity of Texas

512-478-3630 home 512-339-9679 work


Date: Sat, 28 Feb 1998 16:01:32 -0800 (PST) From: Palms and Company <> Subject: My response to Mr. Zadorsky answer.

One man's honest perception may be painful to hear, but it is an opportunity to come into contact with the reality of others rather then your own. That is more important than politeness or diplomacy as a learning experience. Witness the politicians of the world who no longer communicate anything meaningful.

Honesty is not always pleasant but it is not necessarily rude, if it is sincere.

No one is offended by your offense. Your remarks are published by all to see, so we may learn what offends you and find other ways of expressing our honest feelings, while still remaining truthful, if such a thing is possible. I do appreciate your frustration.

We come from different cultures Professor Zadorsky. Anyone not paid for two weeks in our culture never returns to his job. There are many hotels in our cultures far better than the Dnepropetrovsk which charge far less. After 10 years of Ukraine experience many people are tired of making allowance for these cultural differences. We prefer Ukrainians to come to= our cultures, have their meetings in our hotels and stop subjecting us to culture "shock". We sometimes now lose our forbearance. Do not be insulted. Instead admire us for our patience and sincere good will.

In an economy with the per capita income that Ukraine has, a $25 dinner is naturally defined as fleecing the tourist. There is no rationale or justification for it. Charge us what the average Ukrainian pays for his dinner and no more. If you come to our culture that is what you will pay.=20

If you continue to use "caveat emptor" as your slogan, you will be insulted by the truth if you chose to take it that way. Some people call a spade a spade.=20

Mr. Wim A. De Bruyn came at your request to help you. That you interpret for him is the least you can do. He didn't ask you to come to=20 him.

Aesthetic insults of Mr.Wim A. De Bruyn

We understand that language barriers exist. Don't invite me if I don't speak the language, unless you can provide interpreters, that is common courtesy. We know about your past and we don't hold it against you. but if you want to participate get one English speaking Ukrainian for every non-Ukrainian speaking delegate. That is hospitality. Remember his airfare cost mor then all incountry expenses.

I have been travelling the former Soviet Union for ten years and I must say you seem like something out of the past and your furniture does remind me of the 1940's. To you it may be an antique of rare beauty. If you need my help for something you will have to overlook these differences in taste.

Commercial projects may be a means to one of your ends, but that doesn't mean we enjoy being dragged into them. We call that exploiting the situation and in our culture that is not a favorable term. Politeness in our culture means you endure the treatment you get silently. But once home it doesn't mean you have to lie about your feelings. You can attempt to tell us what we have to do when we receive treatment we do not like, but we don't like being told what to do and have the right not to do it.=20

Scientific insults.=20

On the surface my culture doesn't see a disparity between your conference theme and De Bruyn's report theme. If what he has to say was of no interest, you could have determined that well in advance by a little bit of due diligence that you failed to perform. Why didn't you call the waiter and change the table cloth.=20

In our culture the scientific level of a conference is not necessarily determined by the credentials of those who attend. What have all these conferences, several times a year, accomplished.

While we are all pro-Ukrainian and wish its people a speedy recovery from their past difficulties, Ukraine has serious problems resulting from its absence from the global community from 1940 to 1998. Ukarine's periods of splendor and glory which preceded that are not of great comfort at the moment, nor something one can today trade upon.

If you think people like Dr. Dr. Bruyn make these trips to your country for entertainment, you have lost contact with reality. These are tedious difficult journeys that wear down our patience, our spirits and our joy of life. Thee are thousands of more entertaining place son this earth. It also shows that your culture does not understand how little entertainment there is in Ukraine for someone from my culture. Ukraine is your country and you must solve its problems since you make the rules there. It isn't that we couldn't solve your problems, it's that you refuse to consider our solutions.

What you think you understand, is understanding according to your opinion.= =20 You do not ask if it is ours, which we consider equally rude. I tell you western business and science is your hope, whether you believe it or not. Help will come when you finally come to that understanding. Until then we patiently listen and wait for your comprehension.=20

Your science is not supported, not because it is unprofitable, but because it is a waste. Until you reach a point of thinking where you can benefit from support, such support will not help you. it will "entertain' your thought that you are heading somewhere. That is an illusion. its time to face that. Look at your country. Where is the social justice.

Knowledge is never wasted or rejected and to the degree your scientists contribute to it they are automatically supported globally. No one who anticipates receiving any benefit whatsoever, would consider rejecting your offer of co-operation for solving of todays problems. But that is to be determined by the market not by you. Permit us to decide for ourselves such questions. We are not children to be chastised.=20

In our culture, if a person existed such as you have described, guilty of offenses, we would not exclude him, we would make absolutely sure he was invited again and again until he saw the wisdom of your truth. I suggest that you meet Dr. Bruyn with a clean tablecloth, a reasonable price, a friendly tolerance and win him over. He is on your side. Just consider his preferences. If you do that you will be well on the way to earning support from different thinking people.=20

=F3 =D5=D7=C1=D6=C5=CE=C9=C5=CD =C9 =CE=C1=C9=CC=D5=DE=DB=C9=CD=C9= =D0=CF=D6=C5=CC=C1=CE=C9=D1=CD=C9, S uvajheniem i nailuchshimi pozhelaniyami,

Dr. Pyotr Joannevich van de Waal-Palms President, Palms & Company, Inc., Investment Bankers (1934-1997) The United States of America Tel: 1 425 - 828-6774 Fax 1 425 827-5528 E-mail: WWW home page: "Understanding Russian Banking"


Date: Sat, 28 Feb 1998 15:03:01 -0800 (PST) From: Palms and Company <> Subject: The right of answer of Mr. Zadorsky

On Sun, 22 Feb 1998, Wim A. de Bruyn wrote:

> Hello, >=20 > On Wed, 18 Feb 1998 19:22:00 +0300 (UKR), I received the following message > from Mr. Zadorsky:

What is Zadorsky's e-mail address

=F3 =D5=D7=C1=D6=C5=CE=C9=C5=CD =C9 =CE=C1=C9=CC=D5=DE=DB=C9=CD=C9= =D0=CF=D6=C5=CC=C1=CE=C9=D1=CD=C9, S uvajheniem i nailuchshimi pozhelaniyami,=20

Dr. Pyotr Joannevich van de Waal-Palms President, Palms & Company, Inc., Investment Bankers (1934-1997) The United States of America Tel: 1 425 - 828-6774 Fax 1 425 827-5528 E-mail: =20 WWW home page: "Understanding Russian Banking"


End of GreenYes Digest V98 #54 ******************************